Barry McGee and OSGEMEOS are presenting their first-ever collaborative exhibition, One More, at WATARI-UM, The Watari Museum of Contemporary Art. This special project brings together two artist duos who have respected and inspired each other for more than thirty years, filling the shared space through an improvised, organic process.

Since its opening in 1990, WATARI-UM has introduced artists who transcend the boundary between street culture and fine art, such as Andy Warhol and Keith Haring. Its unique curatorial history, rooted in the 1970s, has served as a vital channel connecting street culture and contemporary art, establishing the museum as a singular institution in Japan.

This exhibition is both a “reunion” and a “renewal” made possible precisely within the context of WATARI-UM. One More, which brings to fruition in Tokyo the bond that began in São Paulo in the early 1990s, unfolds the decades-long story shared by the two duos throughout the space. The following presents highlights from the talk event held in conjunction with the exhibition, offering deeper insight into its background.

　A dialogue between legendary artists connected across borders　

──How did the idea for this exhibition come about, and how did it materialize?

Barry：OSGEMEOS and I had been talking for ages about doing a show together. My relationship with WATARI-UM goes very far back; it’s a truly important place for me. It’s where I’ve learned about Japanese artist and art, free expression, and culture. We’re living in a time when artistic freedom is increasingly restricted, but here I still feel like I can paint murals and expressions freely and also share ideas. It feels like a sacred space.

Gustavo：WATARI-UM welcomed us warmly and supported us fully so that we could work freely. With so many restrictions on art around the world today, being allowed to express exactly what we want is a rare and precious opportunity.

Otavio：Before we talk about the show, I want to reflect on our relationship with Barry. We first met in 1993 in São Paulo. He was there for an artist residency and even had a solo show at the Lasar Segall Museum. Barry was a major figure in our lives at that time. When we couldn’t see any hope in our situation, he opened a door for us through art. From the moment we stepped through that door, we never looked back.

Barry：Back then, there were grant programs available for artists. It was called the Lila Wallace/Readers Digest Travel Grant. As a young artist, I wrote a proposal for a residency where I would go to Brazil, learn and exchange culture from local artists. I had no idea about the graffiti scene there at all. I got the grant somehow for about $5,000 and ended up in São Paulo. When I got there, I was shocked. The city was overflowing with graffiti. Every building had graffiti covering it. I thought, “How is this even possible ?” It was truly breathtaking.

Gustavo：In the 1990s, there was almost no information in Brazil about how graffiti was developing elsewhere in the world. The internet wasn’t like it is now, so the “world” existed only in magazines and rumors. Meeting someone from far away was incredibly special. We even used to quietly put our phone number on our murals. One day, our home phone rang, my mother picked up, and the caller turned out to be Barry McGee. That was our first contact.

　Back then, we never imagined what form this encounter would eventually take.—Barry McGee　

Barry：I had no idea then what this meeting would become. Looking back, it turned into something far beyond what I could have imagined. The residency was designed for artists to travel, learn local cultures and art, and bring those experiences back to share with their communities.

Gustavo：Among the few writers in São Paulo at the time, there was one who influenced us especially: “SPETO.” We painted and collaborated with him, and he played a big role in helping us solidify our style. His work is also displayed inside the record shop installation.

Otavio：Barry taught us a lot about what was happening outside Brazil. Our connection is something deep and hard to explain in words. Even if we work together for months, it’s never stressful. It’s joyful. Everything is natural, comfortable, and open. This exhibition recreates what we used to do back then: painting all night, drawing without sleep. The museum made this relationship-based project possible by trusting us and valuing artist-to-artist bonds.

Barry：People wanted to learn from me during the residency, but it was actually a complete exchange. The streets were full of roller tags done with latex paint, and murals on every major wall. I didn’t understand what was happening, but I felt something powerful there.

　This time, we started with “nothing” and were able to try a new approach to creating an exhibition from a completely blank state.—OSGEMEOS　

──Tell us about the production process. How did the murals come together?

Barry：The process felt like playing chess. They made a move, then I responded. It escalated until it turned into something like wrestling. Ideas piled up: “I’ll do this,” “Then we’ll do that,” and eventually this massive show took shape. I even painted some faces, which I haven’t done in a while, because they asked me to revisit the style we used back then.

Gustavo：We’re basically from the same planet, so working together is effortless. We started about ten days before the opening and felt comfortable throughout. The exhibition really reflects our chemistry. Using limited space and found materials, we improvised everything on the spot.

Barry：Growing up in Brazil, they naturally mastered the culture of “making a lot out of little.” That spirit shaped the improvisation and adaptability of this exhibition. What would normally take four years came together intuitively and quickly.

Gustavo:Just being in Tokyo is inspiring. Our experience in Ishinomaki helped us start with nothing this time and create from an empty state. Even after decades of working with Barry, we learn something new every day.

──Graffiti is illegal in many places. Have you had trouble in the past?

Gustavo：In Brazil back then, legal trouble wasn’t really an issue. Today, in São Paulo, if you paint a wall illegally, the wall might be removed and sold somewhere. The situation is completely different now. We painted constantly, even though most of it was unauthorized. Everyday life in São Paulo was unpredictable: robberies, shootings, chaos happening right next to you while you painted. Yes, we’ve been detained, and we’ve been in trouble many times. Even today, if a police car shows up, you never know whether they’ll arrest you, beat you, or ask for a photo. That unpredictability still exists.

　A lot of people probably see graffiti as something very simple, but I have deep respect for the writers who risk their lives to carve their names into the city.—OSGEMEOS　

──Do you plan to do another two-artist exhibition elsewhere?

Barry：The U.S. is in such a chaotic state right now that large-scale projects feel almost impossible. We need to free usa from the fascist pigs.

Gustavo：Most of our public projects have been group exhibitions, so doing a show with Barry in Tokyo at this point in our 30-year history feels very meaningful. After a large retrospective in Washington last year, this show feels like the next major milestone. We still share the same energy we had in 1993. One More is one of the most important events in our lives.

Otavio：This exhibition is truly one of a kind for us. Opportunities like this are becoming increasingly rare. Barry created iconic shows like Street Market, where audiences could step into the world of the artists. You hardly see exhibitions like that anymore. The fact that we could reunite after so long and create an immersive show in Tokyo is incredibly special.

──Has your relationship with graffiti changed as you’ve aged?

Barry：Graffiti still feels like a format that always shows me something new. Just walking down the street, I find lines and ideas I’ve never seen before. I get huge inspiration from younger writers. Graffiti always gives me great inspiration and thought provoking ideas.

Gustavo：Many people think graffiti is simple, but for us it exists outside institutional structures. It’s the most direct, spontaneous form of expression, a way to connect with others on the street. We’ve always respected writers who risk everything to put their name out there. Painting on walls, subways, trains, buildings that don’t belong to you, without permission, purely by your own choice. That respect will never change.

──You’ve known each other since 1993. Why did it take so long to do a show together?

Barry：We stayed in touch through letters and emails, always saying we’d do something together someday. We painted outdoors many times, and in 2007 we even did a train graffiti project in Brazil. That was more exciting than any museum show. But strangely, the chance to do a proper exhibition together never came until now. That’s why this Tokyo show is so special.

Gustavo：I don’t think things happen by chance. They happen when they’re meant to. A place like WATARI-UM doesn’t exist everywhere. Very few institutions truly give artists complete freedom. This show happened because such freedom was possible here.

　When we first encountered graffiti in the 1980s, it felt like a shock, as if we had discovered the art form of our generation.—Barry McGee　

──You are both already active on a global scale, but is there anything you haven’t achieved yet, or something you are still aiming for?

Barry：When I was young, I went to museums often and the work i saw said nothing to me or about my life, I never saw myself reflected in museum collections…it was very sad. In the 80s, discovering graffiti felt like discovering my generation’s art form. It shattered the conventions of painting and the market-driven art world dominated by wealthy white men. Subway art showed us that we were here. Writers like Lee, Dondi, Iz the Wiz and Blade are as inspiring to me as Picasso.

Gustavo：We came from working-class backgrounds, and we’re only here because opportunities arose. Back then there was no social media; we created purely out of love for culture. We believe everyone has a mission, and those who follow theirs will resonate with others regardless of nationality or origin. Everything in this exhibition has a story tied to nearly forty years of experience. We want this show to open a new portal.

Barry：The Japanese visual culture I grew up admiring—markers, anime—was like a dream. I watched subtitled anime for hours without understanding a word. Those images soaked into me, and over time, the pieces started connecting.

Gustavo：We feel deeply connected to Barry through visuals. Imagination and creativity are infinite. We grew up watching Japanese anime too, especially Ultraman, which fueled our imagination. Creativity is the act of seeing how far you can go.

Otavio：This exhibition goes beyond art. For us, it’s about family. Our working style itself is like that: one talks, one draws, and the exchange continues endlessly, as if it could go on forever.